Re: [messengers] Minutes from the Open Forum

Date: 22 Aug 2013 14:21:36 +0200
From: FuegO <fuegal@xxxxxxxxx>


Dear all,

for me & i hope i'won't be alone to think that, as shaw bega said, this
point seems to me the best >

if you can get %100 of the forum to agree with you, the posibilities are
endless

What we do, what we try, where me from, we'll respect and try to get
knoweldges in organisation, provide the best moment to each other when we
meet @ summer
that give us THE reason to stand to stand the rain, the snow in winter
everyfuckingwhere we 're from...

My sensations after this new cmwc, is then we trully realize then we are
together each year , each europeean, world or smaller ecxuse to be reunited.
That's was really strong this time. Everybody seems surprise to be hold by
a wave of true emotions like this, for me it was the case.
I m not a face book fan, i had to said then i used it sor far we start our
compagny, but it's tool, BUT IT WILL BE NEVER THE REAL LIFE
& we spend time all together, in paris first later in lausanne, once again
that's was really powerfull, energizing and for each close best friend
simply great, y a count to meet new person too as guy from washington /
chicago / seatlle / austria / japan / belgium
I just took permission to said that because, australian team come early in
paris, pre event happened & rest of the storys everybody knows.
Paris & Melbourne put a 'bid', each try to be conciancious, but how debate
of 2 spots when both team was together for 10 days !!

We decided, i can say, nevermind the bolloks where the next cmwc will take
place by the way it 'll happened, cos 'you' ( older messenger, commitee,
everyone who involded innit before us ), you set up the rules, you give a
definition to that, then we're all respect it, as delivery on time an
urgent stuff.
I m sure then if someone will propose something who accross those lines, a
friend near you and will said : 'boy, you're not ok' or just said nothing,
it's not fluid, everyone will know.

So 2015, this melbourne fuck yeah !!! next year mexico another country of
chistole, 2016 paris maybe or not, we're young we have the time, but we'll
invite you one year for sure
imagine riga in latvia, imagine africa dakar senegal, imagine argentina,
imagine seattle

Of course rule are there & it's perfect, perfect coz it stay beetween us,
paid attention to that is important for futur, we grow up, we share, we
never lie, &  the posibilities are endless coz we're down for whatever

++


fuego, paris





On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:25 AM, Andy Zalan <zalandy@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> it technically is: 2 years out - proposal, 1 year out - final bid. except
> that the host city is for all intents and purposes selected 2 years out,
> after only the initial proposal. only 1 city is selected initially, with
> the idea being that the next year said city will show up with whatever
> progress they have made and if it is deemed they have not met some
> undefined, minimum expectation, there would be a vote of no confidence and
> no cmwc that year. but of course that will never happen. nobody will choose
> no cmwc when there is a city bidding to host, no matter how unorganized
> they seem or how little they have to present at the open forum. what we
> need to do is to select the best 2 or 3 proposals from the initial bids 2
> years in advance, let them work on their bids for a year, come back,
> present again, showing all the progress they have made, and then a final
> vote between those 2 cities is made in 1 year in advance. am i making
> sense?
>
> as for the idea of making the host city selection rules "modifiable on the
> fly", i am not sure what that even means. as far as i know, any and all
> rules can be amended at a cmwc if it is agreed upon at the open forum. this
> however creates the dilemma that makes the board of the ifbma basically
> useless, because they can't make any changes or do anything without
> approval from the open forum. really, the ifbma board needs to be granted
> certain powers and authority that go beyond just the open forums. it also
> needs a budget and a strictly defined mission.
>
> and also, maybe we should consider a name change. the international
> federation of bicycle messenger associations? really? how many bma's are
> there anymore? the way i see it, this is really about messenger
> championships not messenger associations. it would be great to hold
> conferences and discuss worker issues and the like, but there is barely
> time to hold the 2 open forums as it is. if we were to try to tackle these
> types of issues, it would have to be at a time other than at the cmwc.
>
> we haven't used consensus in a long time. it is a straight vote, majority
> wins.
>
> --
> az
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 8:34 PM, Joel Metz <magpie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > which is how i thought it was supposed to happen. 2 years proposal, 1
> year
> > final bid.
> >
> > im not really enthused about the idea of making the cmwc host city
> > selection rules modifiable on the fly. a little bit too pat mcquaid for
> me
> > :)
> >
> > but hey, i havent been able to get to cmwc since 2005, so my voice in
> this
> > is limited :)
> >
> > -joel
> >
> > > I don't see the point in not giving it to the bidding city 2 years out.
> > > How
> > > little "evidence" would a city need to show for there really be a vote
> of
> > > no confidence? Never gonna happen.
> > >
> > > I've proposed it before, I think bids should be heard and accepted 2
> > years
> > > out, narrowed down to a field of 2, maybe 3 eligible cities, who then
> > > present again 1 year out for final vote. That gives cities 1 year to
> > > really
> > > put something on paper, promotes competitiveness, and then gives the
> > > winning city that 2nd year to really iron out the details and do the
> > heavy
> > > lifting. But hey, what do I know?
> > > See you in Mexico! That is if they still got the bid. Lemme check the
> > rule
> > > book...
> > > --
> > > AZ
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > pssst... come to my race on saturday. it is a fun(d)racer. you can even
> > > play along from home.
> > > https://www.facebook.com/events/566546996728829/
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 4:19 PM, <sunaltahusky@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >
> > >> One day we will all send our drones.
> > >>
> > >> Sent from my iPhone
> > >>
> > >> On 2013-08-21, at 3:53 PM, Shawn bega Blumenfeld <shawnbega@xxxxxxxxx
> >
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > yeah joel where you been? the process has morphed some since 2005,
> the
> > >> > date on those webpages.
> > >> >
> > >> > while its mostly as written, the current process that has been
> > >> > followed recently: cities bid 2 years out and one city is chosen at
> > >> > the 2 year out open forum. that city must then present a final bid
> for
> > >> > confirmation one year out. if they dont seem capable and are refused
> > >> > by the one year out forum, an emergency situation would then have to
> > >> > be discussed. i didnt see it in these minutes, it may have happened
> at
> > >> > the first open forum or may have gotten skipped, but i know at least
> > >> > that mexico was prepared to give a final presentation for 2014.
> > >> >
> > >> > i reiterate my recommendation from last year: i believe a motion
> > >> > should be made next time to eliminate proxy votes. they dont matter,
> > >> > and are contrary to a consensus process.
> > >> >
> > >> > i reiterate my desire to see at least those specific pages at
> > >> > messengers.org updated to reflect the current process.
> > >> >
> > >> > mexico mexico mexico. cant fricken wait. im running "velodrome day"
> at
> > >> > which ive been told we'll be allowed to race the track with non
> track
> > >> > bikes. long live the derailleur!
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Shawn "bega" Blumenfeld
> > >> > http://www.dcbikeracing.com
> > >> > --
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 9:29 AM, Blaize Felberbaum
> > >> > <blaize.felberbaum@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >> >> Lausanne Open Forum took a decision as described on the IFBMA
> status
> > >> (
> > >> http://messengers.org/?page_id=126). Melbourne will have to meet the
> > >> requirements for the final bid in CMWC Mexico in 2014 (
> > >> http://messengers.org/?page_id=124).
> > >> >>
> > >> >> But that up to next year Open Forum to decide.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Blaize.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Le 21 août 2013 à 15:20, Joel Metz a écrit :
> > >> >>
> > >> >>> final vote for cmwc 2 years in advance? i guess procedures have
> > >> changed...
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> -joel
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>>> 4. CMWC 2015
> > >> >>>> Reps of Melbourne and Paris present the final argumentation for
> the
> > >> vote
> > >> >>>> of CMWC 2015
> > >> >>>> Proxy vote shows that both city collected the exact same votes
> > >> (Under
> > >> the
> > >> >>>> control of a member of the council. We swiss don't joke about
> > >> democracy!).
> > >> >>>> Messenger  at the open forum choose a city in between the 2 in
> the
> > >> race
> > >> >>>> for 2015 (non-messengers are asked to step aside the vote). A
> short
> > >> >>>> majority chooses Melbourne.
> > >> >>>> After a few more arguments, reps from Paris choose to withdraw
> from
> > >> CMWC
> > >> >>>> 2015 bid.
> > >> >>>> Therefore a consensus is reached and MELBOURNE IS OFFICIALLY
> VOTED
> > >> HOST
> > >> >>>> CITY FOR CMWC 2015.
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> --
> > >> >>> joel metz : magpie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx : http://www.blackbirdsf.org/
> > >> >>> magpie messenger collective   :    http://magpiemessenger.com/
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> _______________________________________________
> > >> >>> Messengers mailing list
> > >> >>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
> > >> >>> http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> > >> >>
> > >> >> _______________________________________________
> > >> >> Messengers mailing list
> > >> >> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
> > >> >> http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> > >> > _______________________________________________
> > >> > Messengers mailing list
> > >> > Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
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> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Messengers mailing list
> > >> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
> > >> http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> > >>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Messengers mailing list
> > > Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
> > > http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > joel metz : magpie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx : http://www.blackbirdsf.org/
> > magpie messenger collective   :    http://magpiemessenger.com/
> >
> >
> >
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