Re: [messengers] super mess market / mall mess life / migros mess life / hyper discount mess life / hard discount soon

Date: 23 Apr 2014 06:34:22 -0000
From: pinkfixie@xxxxxxxxx


What would be a 'fair agreement'? 
x Ashira 

-------------------------------
www.AshiraSiegel.com


> On Apr 22, 2014, at 11:21 PM, "Jérôme Thiriet" <jeromethiriet@xxxxxx> wrote:
> 
>  the (my) problem with cinelli: they do take advantage of the fact that
>  they usually face amateurs when it comes to sponsorship management at
>  messengers events. they are ripping off hard working organisers who
>  create great events with a unique atmosphere where they can easily put
>  their brand/logo on every competitors head for absolutely NO MONEY. for
>  me that just does not seem to be a fair deal. they get way more than
>  they give. that makes me feel sad and angry. it only gets worse when
>  organisers sell the hats to the messengers so they can pay the bill
>  that should be paid by cinelli...
> 
>  nobody (not hammerbone nor chuey) should be given such an opportunity.
>  its a lousy deal. whenever we sell the messenger spirit we should at
>  least do it right and make fair agreements.
> 
>  Jerome Thiriet
>  Mittlere Strasse 12
>  4056 Basel
>  G: +41(0)61 206 10 00
>  Mobile: +41(0)79 381 24 39
>  jeromethiriet@xxxxxx
> 
> 
>  Gesendet: Dienstag, 22. April 2014 um 23:33 Uhr
>  Von: zalandy@xxxxxxxxx
>  An: "matteo castronuovo" <m.castronuovo@xxxxxxxxxx>
>  Cc: "messengers@xxxxxxxxx" <messengers@xxxxxxxxx>
>  Betreff: Re: [messengers] super mess market / mall mess life / migros
>  mess life / hyper discount mess life / hard discount soon
>  I agree: it's perfect marketing strategy! I just don't see a problem
>  with it.
>  Perhaps Hammerbone or Chuey would be willing to donate 100-500 custom
>  printed cycling caps? But then THEY would be getting the sneaky, cheap
>  publicity...
>  It sounds like the problem is with the sponsor and not the sponsorship.
>  It is absolutely every organizer's right to accept/refuse any
>  sponsorship as they see fit, but once you start injecting your personal
>  morality into it, you start up a very slippery slope.
>  Additionally, it is nice to hear what the "people" want, I'm sure the
>  organizers only want to make "the people" happy, but be careful and
>  sensitive with your criticism.
>  Kudos to all who have organized messenger events, big and small! It can
>  be hard and under appreciated work. AZ loves you.
>>> On Apr 22, 2014, at 5:11 PM, matteo castronuovo
>>  <m.castronuovo@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> 
>> My dear Andy,
>> the problem is:
>> o cinelli cap are not produced by cinelli, but is other company that
>  gives to cinelli the merchandising.
>> o cinelli can sell the cmc cap in his website and give to the cmc
>  organization part of money and part of cap to selling
>> o cinelli gives the caps for the messenger event 'cause they have big
>  visibility with small investment.
>> In every picture about cmc you'll find someone with cinelli cap,
>  that's his secret.
>> Isn't just a cap, is a perfect marketing strategy.
>> 
>> See ya in mexico
>> 
>> Matteo
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> /////////////////////////////////////////////
>> Matteo Castronuovo
>> Marketing e Comunicazione
>> 
>> m.castronuovo@xxxxxxxxxx
>> ph. +39 3426853559
>> /////////////////////////////////////////////
>> 
>> 0245558500
>> 
>> Urban Bike Messengers srl
>> c/o Avanzi, via ampere 61/A
>> 20131 Milano
>> P.I.e C.F. 06891640960
>> Consegniamo una Milano piu pulita.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2014-04-22 22:52 GMT+02:00 <zalandy@xxxxxxxxx>:
>>> To play devils advocate for a minute: in exchange for the caps, what
>  did Cinelli want? Did they ever try to prohibit anyone from selling the
>  caps? As far as I see it, every free cap equals $10-$15 for the race.
>  What's the problem?
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Andy
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 22, 2014, at 4:28 PM, Blaize Felberbaum
>  <blaize.felberbaum@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 2 things Willy. Maybe 3...
>>>> 1. To my knowledge, Cinelli never gave 1$ to any CMC, free caps
>  doesn't help organizing anything.
>>>> 2. Insulting people (including these lazy french messengers) does
>  no good to anyone nor to the discussion.
>>>> 3. I love you as much as the rest of our beautiful community!
>>>> 
>>>> blz.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> Le 22 avr. 2014 `a 21:23, Willy Wonker <fetologist@xxxxxxxxx> a
>  ecrit :
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Why say 'fuck them'? Who are you? A bike messenger, do you think
>  people care about bike messengers? You're someone who delivers parcels
>  on a bicycle. We have somehow come to believe we are special, we are
>  doing the world a favour. We are not doing the hardest job in the
>  world, we do not have the coolest job in the world. We are delivery
>  people doing trivial work. We're too good to align our events with the
>  corporate world but we'll deliver for BP and Monsanto. We ride through
>  red lights like it is our right. We cycle drunk and cause damage. We
>  intimidate the public and spit at anyone who questions us. But we are
>  too good for an energy drink who gives us free product and helps pay to
>  organise an event we want to run.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Why take a dig at Nadir and Race the Place? The event opened up a
>  part of the city that was shut down. It gave cyclists a chance to enjoy
>  a race in their city, possibly meet new people and work on new ideas
>  for the future. It helped raise money for the BMEF. It helped out
>  brother Fish out with some prize money and product to continue his
>  dream of racing around the world. But because it had a corporate name
>  in front of it you shit on it. Who do you think paid for the set up?
>  Who helped get the permits from the city? No one is forcing you to buy
>  their drink or drink it when it's free.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I would love to be able to organise the CMWC without any sponsors
>  or only with sponsors that are aligned with my core values but the
>  reality is that I value my friends more than that. I don't expect
>  people to pay 1500 dollars to fly to Mexico and sit in my apartment and
>  do an alleycat. I want them to have a great an experience as possible
>  in the short time they are here.
>>>>> Perhaps the hat deal is not great. Have you tried to raise money
>  for a messenger event in a 3rd world city where people don't know what
>  bike messengers are? It may be nothing for them to give us a few
>  hundred hats but if I can sell those hats I have a few thousand
>  dollars. Perhaps you should go and take a look at the registration page
>  at mexicocmwc.com. Have a look at the ticks next to peoples names and
>  see that about 60% of people have not paid the pre registration. A pre
>  registration that I kept lower than most CMWCs that I can remember.
>  Perhaps you'll notice, Fuego, a tick missing next to your name. You're
>  too cheap to help your brothers in Mexico out by pre registering but
>  too classy to let me take a sponsor's money without trying to guilt
>  trip me. You stay proudly French then, the French who couldn't be
>  bothered to put an alleycat on for the Sister City Cat event. An event
>  designed by messengers to raise money from our communities
>>>>> so we don't have to rely as much on corporate support for the
>  CMWC. The French who harass women on the street in their bid videos to
>  trying to win the right to host the CMWC. The French who never have
>  more than two representatives at a messenger event outside of Europe.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It's very easy to point a finger outwards but perhaps it's time
>  to look at ourselves. We complain about our lack of rights but good
>  luck trying to get a group of messengers to stand up for them. We
>  believe we deserve better but wont work for it. 5% of messengers work
>  their arses off while the rest sit back, free load and make shitty
>  remarks. Maybe if messengers all gave a shit we would be able to run
>  events they way we wanted. I'm not saying anything new, those who know
>  know and the rest don't give a shit.
>>>>> 
>>>>> So excuse me now, while I go suck some more corporate dick, so
>  that when Fuego gets to Mexico he can run around naked with a pill up
>  his arse, a cheap beer in one hand, a free tequila in the other with a
>  well priced, non branded cycling jersey in a messenger bag he'll
>  probably win by doing something as meaningless as skidding his back
>  tyre.
>>>>> On Tuesday, 22 April 2014 8:34 AM, nadir olivet
>  <wooracer@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> How did this happen?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Zero
>>>>> 
>>>>> --- Original Message ---
>>>>> 
>>>>> From: "Jerome Thiriet" <jeromethiriet@xxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: 22 April, 2014 8:34 AM
>>>>> To: "Luc Unternaehrer" <luc_beson@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Cc: messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: Re: [messengers] super mess market / mall mess life /
>  migros mess life / hyper discount mess life / hard discount soon
>>>>> 
>>>>> too late FuegO! Cinelli has already bought the global marketing
>  rights
>>>>> for all messenger championships and any messenger related event.
>  those
>>>>> rights dont seem to be very valuable though as they go for a
>  stack of
>>>>> low quality cycling caps each year...
>>>>> 
>>>>> you have to call the messenguerilla to change something my friend
>  :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Jerome Thiriet
>>>>> Mittlere Strasse 12
>>>>> 4056 Basel
>>>>> G: +41(0)61 206 10 00
>>>>> Mobile: +41(0)79 381 24 39
>>>>> jeromethiriet@xxxxxx
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Gesendet: Dienstag, 22. April 2014 um 13:51 Uhr
>>>>> Von: "Luc Unternaehrer" <luc_beson@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> An: "fabrice fuego" <fuegal@xxxxxxxxx>, "messengers@xxxxxxxxx"
>>>>> <messengers@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Betreff: Re: [messengers] super mess market / mall mess life /
>  migros
>>>>> mess life / hyper discount mess life / hard discount soon
>>>>> word fuego! ;)
>>>>>> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2014 13:40:09 +0200
>>>>>> From: fuegal@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> To: messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> Subject: [messengers] super mess market / mall mess life /
>  migros
>>>>> mess life / hyper discount mess life / hard discount soon
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Bonjour
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I 'm a messenger, and i drink some redbull, coz i'm thirsty ,
>  water
>>>>> or beer
>>>>>> this is punk ass mess life too much
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> by luck i had some oakley glasses wich is really confortable
>  because
>>>>> there
>>>>>> is sun, & i had eyes
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I used to love cinelli because .... i don't remember but mash &
>  co.
>>>>> use it
>>>>>> so it's coooooool,
>>>>>> this built in china but we don't give a fuck ....
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I had a head & i'm separate beetween, giro & bern
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The bearings of my hub are gift by ...........
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> i'm sorry i stay french, i neeed to say then there is too much
>  brand,
>>>>> and
>>>>>> other bad deal with brand and fake industry then one day we'll
>  lost
>>>>> our
>>>>>> soul in a super market
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> fuck the event with red bull, fuck cinelli they never get us,
>>>>>> just keep in mind then the last red hook was win by a french who
>  ride
>>>>> a
>>>>>> bamboo bike ;) .....
>>>>>> it seems then everybody don't care too,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [1][1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7UftStYuqE
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> so who sale the mess world ?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> i trust in mexico, i hope i 'll had a chistole in an historical
>  city,
>>>>>> hopefully meet local boyz & drink mescal
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> have a nice day everyone
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Fabrice_Levannier / Fuego /
>>>>>> +33660381389
>>>>>> [2][2]http://www.parisdropit.com/
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> [3][3]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [4][4]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [5]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7UftStYuqE
>>>>> 2. [6]http://www.parisdropit.com/
>>>>> 3. [7]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> 4. [8]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [9]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [10]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [11]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Messengers mailing list
>>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>>> [12]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Messengers mailing list
>>> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>>> [13]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> /////////////////////////////////////////////
>> Matteo Castronuovo
>> Marketing e Comunicazione
>> 
>> m.castronuovo@xxxxxxxxxx
>> ph. +39 3426853559
>> /////////////////////////////////////////////
>> 
>> 0245558500
>> 
>> Urban Bike Messengers srl
>> c/o Avanzi, via ampere 61/A
>> 20131 Milano
>> P.I.e C.F. 06891640960
>> Consegniamo una Milano piu pulita.
>  _______________________________________________
>  Messengers mailing list
>  Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
>  [14]http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 
> References
> 
>  1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7UftStYuqE
>  2. http://www.parisdropit.com/
>  3. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>  4. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>  5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7UftStYuqE
>  6. http://www.parisdropit.com/
>  7. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>  8. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
>  9. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 10. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 11. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 12. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 13. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> 14. http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers
> _______________________________________________
> Messengers mailing list
> Messengers@xxxxxxxxx
> http://ifbma.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/messengers